CDC and Fry Lab blood smear--weird info!

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LymeEnigma
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Re: CDC and Fry Lab blood smear--weird info!

Post by LymeEnigma » Tue 29 Jul 2008 20:12

But maybe, just maybe, Fry labs has produced nothing but numerous pictures of misinterpreted "artifacts" on those slides, and the CDC really has not been contacted.... I choose to reserve judgment backing the lab until I see some proof that they're not just another fly-by-night looking to bank on desperate Lymies....

Hiker, I think it was right of you to contact the CDC. There's already enough blind faith in Lymeland; we don't need more blind faith ... we need more solid answers. Kudos to you, for having the backbone to take that step.

hiker53
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Re: CDC and Fry Lab blood smear--weird info!

Post by hiker53 » Wed 30 Jul 2008 1:53

I also called the Univesity of Illinois Veterinary clinic who said smears are not used for mycoplasma or hemobart, but PCR should easily tell which it is even if it in an unknown mycoplasma--the genes would be similar. Smears used to be used but not with the stain that Fry used. Fry labs uses a nonFDA approved stain and it says that right on the photo. I asked if they would check my blood, but they would not. :D

Dr. M--whom Cave suggested--said that myocplasmas were not his expertise, but an electron microscope is usually used to see them as a regular scope does not do the job. Obviously the photos from Fry are not from electron microscopes.

Spoke to Dr. Fry himself who said it was a mycoplasma and that within a month or two the lab should have the right protocol to determine what it is. I don't quite understand that. He has not reported it to the CDC he said because it is not required to report hemobart or mycoplasma.

He also said that any biting arthropod or insect could possibly transmit this. That is another reason why I think the CDC should be informed. If the scenario were to play out that we have a mycoplasma transmitted by ticks, flies, mosquitoes etc. then we will have an epidemic that will be much worse than lyme.

Unfortunately I did not have a list of questions ready when Dr. Fry called me back as his receptionist said it would be tomorrow and it was within the hour. I do give him kudos for calling me back, though.

I spent most of the day on this, plus talking to my own lyme doctor who did not even go to the Kansas City conference where many lyme doctors spoke and he is only a couple of hours away. He was not very helpful.

Hiker53

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LymeEnigma
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Re: CDC and Fry Lab blood smear--weird info!

Post by LymeEnigma » Wed 30 Jul 2008 2:19

I wonder if there is any way someone who has had the Fry test could have his/her slide photos sent to a third (nonpartisan) party for further analysis?

rlstanley
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Re: CDC and Fry Lab blood smear--weird info!

Post by rlstanley » Wed 30 Jul 2008 2:40

Hiker wrote:

I also called the Univesity of Illinois Veterinary clinic who said smears are not used for mycoplasma or hemobart, but PCR should easily tell which it is even if it in an unknown mycoplasma--the genes would be similar. Smears used to be used but not with the stain that Fry used. Fry labs uses a nonFDA approved stain and it says that right on the photo. I asked if they would check my blood, but they would not
You are working this good!

Can you go back and ask the University people for a RECOMMENDATION of a lab who could run a PCR? I would want to have an independent lab check this out. I'd hammer at the academics.

BTW a Lyme doc whom I have great respect for runs his labs at TWO different laboratories.

You indicated people on LymeNet were slamming you. Shame on those people.

Rita

kelmo
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Re: CDC and Fry Lab blood smear--weird info!

Post by kelmo » Wed 30 Jul 2008 4:02

I had my bloodwork done at two labs...Dr. F himself has them sent to your insurance* contracted lab as well as his own.

I think "slammed" is inaccurate and inflammatory. There was a misunderstanding causing a reaction, but I think it's been settled by now.


*Editing to add that it is sent to the outside lab if you are a patient of his. If you have it mailed to him, he assumes you have already had it tested by another lab, which is most often the case.

cave76
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Re: CDC and Fry Lab blood smear--weird info!

Post by cave76 » Wed 30 Jul 2008 4:26

People are doing good investigative work here. I love that. :)

hanegalen
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Re: CDC and Fry Lab blood smear--weird info!

Post by hanegalen » Wed 30 Jul 2008 10:51

hi kelmo

did not quite understand your last post- have you had blood-smears made in another lab (outside lab- as you write)?- or just the serological tests?
I ask because I did, but unfortunately they couldnt find anything in the new smear.That may be due to the fact that I had abx in between the 2 smears.Or due to many other factors.

yours
Gale

itsy
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Re: CDC and Fry Lab blood smear--weird info!

Post by itsy » Wed 30 Jul 2008 13:55

The facts as we know them right now are interesting.

How much does it cost to get this test done?

If it is not a common disease from any bug bite and just from a tick as a co- to lyme (just hypothetical, mind you, cause we do not know yet, right?), and a 'newer' disease, I shouldn't have it. I got lyme w/rash in '74 and haven't had a tick attachment since '83ish, a dog tick.

Therefore, i hypothecize that I would possibly not have this creature on my cells, if those circumstances were possible. If I have it, I would have to assume everyone's smears would look that way.

So, how much would it cost to guinea pig myself? I'll put out a cookie jar and we can all donate to an experiment.I sound flippant but I am completely serious.

cave76
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Re: CDC and Fry Lab blood smear--weird info!

Post by cave76 » Wed 30 Jul 2008 14:32

itsy, sounds like a fun idea to make you a guinea pig <g> but to do an experiment using you----with this premise:
I got lyme w/rash in '74 and haven't had a tick attachment since '83ish, a dog tick.
is a bit dicey. Nymph ticks are so tiny, that even when engorged aren't easily seen if in the hair or ?? And I've heard that their bite doesn't hurt either, as an adult tick does.

So, can we use you for another experiment?? Huh? Huh? Pretty please?

kelmo
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Re: CDC and Fry Lab blood smear--weird info!

Post by kelmo » Wed 30 Jul 2008 16:03

Gale...Fry sends out for the Western Blot. Only he does the blood smear. He's run titers on viruses for me, as well.

What I'm saying is you are not exclusively bound to use his facility when you get tests, you are free to use your own lab (usually in USA, the medical insurance you buy contracts with certain labs).

(As for my comment about hiker getting slammed. After I posted that, I checked Lymenet, and there was one that was a bit more hostile. It was too strong.)

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